10 replies to this topic

[justryod3]

nobody seems to be talking about how jennings got majority of minutes rather than ellis against raptors and lit them up for 19 assists, i think we all know who the true point guard on the team is

 

whudup sillybilly

[SillyBilly]

It was a good game by Jennings, especially the part where he only shot 12 times. Hopefully that continues. The number of assists was impressive but this was more the result of an abundance of easy assist opportunities rather than Brandon expertly carving up the defense. He had some nice finds of a cutting Moute, gave the ball up to Dunleavy and Redick coming around screens, kicked out to Ersan more than usual, and had a few impressive penetration dishes to Larry. But it was one game and it was against the Raptors. Fingers crossed it continues against better competition. If this team has to choose between Jennings and Ellis in the offseason I firmly believe they should choose Ellis. While he is a bit older he is considerably more athletic than Brandon and is either better or slightly better in every aspect of the game except 3 pt shooting. Ellis may be the quickest player in the league and his athleticism allows him to do some things that no one else on the Bucks can do, such as what he did in the sequence on his overtime assist to Larry. That kind of thing can work against even the best defense, if he can continue to play less-selfishly as he has the past 4 games he will be very valuable. Either way a battle for assists between Ellis and Jennings would be the greatest thing that could happen to the Bucks this season.

[justryod3]

It was a good game by Jennings, especially the part where he only shot 12 times. Hopefully that continues. The number of assists was impressive but this was more the result of an abundance of easy assist opportunities rather than Brandon expertly carving up the defense. He had some nice finds of a cutting Moute, gave the ball up to Dunleavy and Redick coming around screens, kicked out to Ersan more than usual, and had a few impressive penetration dishes to Larry. But it was one game and it was against the Raptors. Fingers crossed it continues against better competition. If this team has to choose between Jennings and Ellis in the offseason I firmly believe they should choose Ellis. While he is a bit older he is considerably more athletic than Brandon and is either better or slightly better in every aspect of the game except 3 pt shooting. Ellis may be the quickest player in the league and his athleticism allows him to do some things that no one else on the Bucks can do, such as what he did in the sequence on his overtime assist to Larry. That kind of thing can work against even the best defense, if he can continue to play less-selfishly as he has the past 4 games he will be very valuable. Either way a battle for assists between Ellis and Jennings would be the greatest thing that could happen to the Bucks this season.

your arguements are always complete bs just admit you are wrong for once instead of running in circles, you do not get 19 assists from an abundance of "easy passes" he earned the assists he set the guys up he found the cutters the open shooters that is a pg's job whether you think they are easy passes or not. now to the next idioc comment, ellis' 3 game streak was against atlanta where he was matched up with another pg playing sg where ellis had the advantage, than dallas where they have absolutely no post presense  on defense all he had to do was beat his man with his speed, than to houston a team known for being all offense whit horrible defense. so his 19 assists has absolutely nothing to do with who we were playing, with all that being said i seriously am a big fan of what ellis does so im not gonna play the pick one or the other game you decided to go with, ellis is a scorer and being as good at it as he is he also a good passer cause of the oppurtunities, jennings is far more of a true point guard although he obviously can score so everyone assumes hes just a scoring point guard hes more of a flexible do what is needed point guard.

 

this combination works despite everyone hating it, i like how they both can score and both can make great passes at any point, its just a matter of who the players surrounding these 2 are. bringing in redick clearly was a good play because its just opening up everything for jennings and ellis 

 

finally i would love to point out your "has jennings ever even had 32 assists in 3 games in his career"...well he just did it in 2 night instead of 3 and it was 36 not 32

[Kevin]

Honestly, your problem is that you seem to believe that we all have it out for Jennings. Contrary to those beliefs, we don't blame all of Milwaukee's failings on the Young Buck, nor would we ever. We do, however, fairly point out the problems we see in his game, as we do with anyone else on the team. It's not picking favorites, it's not placing the blame on one guy. It's a team thing.

 

That being said, yes, Jennings has largely been fantastic since the All Star break, putting up two big games against the Nets, followed by three average performances against Atlanta, Dallas and Houston, and now two huge games against Toronto and Utah.

 

If he can keep up performances like this consistently, not saying 17+ assists, but somewhere near double digits while taking efficient shots, that's fantastic. 

Same goes with Ellis in terms of his efficiency. 

Most importantly, I think it's showing how huge an impact Redick is having on this team. Not always in his own numbers, necessarily (though he's been very efficient, putting up double digit scoring every night as a Buck), but for how he's spread the floor and made things so much easier for Jennings and Ellis in terms of creating offense for both themselves and for others. The floor spacing has been something to marvel at. 

[justryod3]

Honestly, your problem is that you seem to believe that we all have it out for Jennings. Contrary to those beliefs, we don't blame all of Milwaukee's failings on the Young Buck, nor would we ever. We do, however, fairly point out the problems we see in his game, as we do with anyone else on the team. It's not picking favorites, it's not placing the blame on one guy. It's a team thing.

 

That being said, yes, Jennings has largely been fantastic since the All Star break, putting up two big games against the Nets, followed by three average performances against Atlanta, Dallas and Houston, and now two huge games against Toronto and Utah.

 

If he can keep up performances like this consistently, not saying 17+ assists, but somewhere near double digits while taking efficient shots, that's fantastic. 

Same goes with Ellis in terms of his efficiency. 

Most importantly, I think it's showing how huge an impact Redick is having on this team. Not always in his own numbers, necessarily (though he's been very efficient, putting up double digit scoring every night as a Buck), but for how he's spread the floor and made things so much easier for Jennings and Ellis in terms of creating offense for both themselves and for others. The floor spacing has been something to marvel at. 

i simply read what you guys say than directly respond from that so idk what to tell you except that everything i said was towards him and not you

[Kevin]

i simply read what you guys say than directly respond from that so idk what to tell you except that everything i said was towards him and not you

I know that it was directed towards him. And in that regard, my response was supporting his stances on Jennings as well, but also reiterating that it's not like he hates Jennings or something.

[Patti]

"Either way a battle for assists between Ellis and Jennings would be the greatest thing that could happen to the Bucks this season."

 

Or maybe that has been the problem with these two guys playing together all along.  Their roles not clearly defined.  Jennings passes the ball to Ellis and he takes over as point on any/every play.  Then Jennings gets the ball and feels he has to try and score.  Both players forcing shots and both players missing them at the same inefficient fg%.

 

What this team has needed is a scoring guard, which is why I was hopeful that bringing in Redick would clarify why our offense keeps breaking down even though we have this talent in the back-court.  

 

What I see the last two games is a better flow to the offense because they are playing their positions instead of fighting each other to take over the game.  Jennings isn't going to get bigger, so feed to Ellis strength at the rim.  Too often we saw Ellis jacking up a long jumper with 20 on the shot clock.  Let Jennings be the point guard and he has shown that he can play that position well.  He's better at the 3 pt and free throw.  Let Ellis be the scoring guard and he has shown that he can make some incredible shots.  Competing with each other does not seem to make for the best result...playing to each of their strengths does.

[justryod3]

"Either way a battle for assists between Ellis and Jennings would be the greatest thing that could happen to the Bucks this season."

 

Or maybe that has been the problem with these two guys playing together all along.  Their roles not clearly defined.  Jennings passes the ball to Ellis and he takes over as point on any/every play.  Then Jennings gets the ball and feels he has to try and score.  Both players forcing shots and both players missing them at the same inefficient fg%.

 

What this team has needed is a scoring guard, which is why I was hopeful that bringing in Redick would clarify why our offense keeps breaking down even though we have this talent in the back-court.  

 

What I see the last two games is a better flow to the offense because they are playing their positions instead of fighting each other to take over the game.  Jennings isn't going to get bigger, so feed to Ellis strength at the rim.  Too often we saw Ellis jacking up a long jumper with 20 on the shot clock.  Let Jennings be the point guard and he has shown that he can play that position well.  He's better at the 3 pt and free throw.  Let Ellis be the scoring guard and he has shown that he can make some incredible shots.  Competing with each other does not seem to make for the best result...playing to each of their strengths does.

its good to hear someone that understands

[SillyBilly]

i simply read what you guys say than directly respond from that so idk what to tell you except that everything i said was towards him and not you

 

 

your arguements are always complete bs just admit you are wrong for once instead of running in circles, you do not get 19 assists from an abundance of "easy passes" he earned the assists he set the guys up he found the cutters the open shooters that is a pg's job whether you think they are easy passes or not. now to the next idioc comment, ellis' 3 game streak was against atlanta where he was matched up with another pg playing sg where ellis had the advantage, than dallas where they have absolutely no post presense  on defense all he had to do was beat his man with his speed, than to houston a team known for being all offense whit horrible defense. so his 19 assists has absolutely nothing to do with who we were playing, with all that being said i seriously am a big fan of what ellis does so im not gonna play the pick one or the other game you decided to go with, ellis is a scorer and being as good at it as he is he also a good passer cause of the oppurtunities, jennings is far more of a true point guard although he obviously can score so everyone assumes hes just a scoring point guard hes more of a flexible do what is needed point guard.

 

this combination works despite everyone hating it, i like how they both can score and both can make great passes at any point, its just a matter of who the players surrounding these 2 are. bringing in redick clearly was a good play because its just opening up everything for jennings and ellis 

 

finally i would love to point out your "has jennings ever even had 32 assists in 3 games in his career"...well he just did it in 2 night instead of 3 and it was 36 not 32

 

I don't think any of my criticism of Jennings play before the trade deadline was wrong, and in fact the past 5 games have strongly indicated that I and many others were right: The Bucks have enough collective talent and will be more successful if the ball is distributed more rather than having Jennings and Ellis take such a high volume of shots.

 

I was wrong about Brandon Jennings capability to be a passing pg. After almost four seasons of watching him be a shoot-first player I hadn't seen much out of him as far as vision and creation aside from some flashes and isolated instances. But I shouldn't have doubted him, the kid's go tremendous talent and there is no reason he can't be a hell of a pure pg, he definitely demonstrated some capability lately. It is in the team's best interest for him to continue to pass the ball and get his teammates involved, which probably means his per game shot total hovers somewhere around 12 or less rather than the 17 he has been shooting. Ersan and Dunleavy were 4-20 last night, thats not going to happen often, the results should have been better.

[SillyBilly]

"Either way a battle for assists between Ellis and Jennings would be the greatest thing that could happen to the Bucks this season."

 

Or maybe that has been the problem with these two guys playing together all along.  Their roles not clearly defined.  Jennings passes the ball to Ellis and he takes over as point on any/every play.  Then Jennings gets the ball and feels he has to try and score.  Both players forcing shots and both players missing them at the same inefficient fg%.

 

What this team has needed is a scoring guard, which is why I was hopeful that bringing in Redick would clarify why our offense keeps breaking down even though we have this talent in the back-court.  

 

What I see the last two games is a better flow to the offense because they are playing their positions instead of fighting each other to take over the game.  Jennings isn't going to get bigger, so feed to Ellis strength at the rim.  Too often we saw Ellis jacking up a long jumper with 20 on the shot clock.  Let Jennings be the point guard and he has shown that he can play that position well.  He's better at the 3 pt and free throw.  Let Ellis be the scoring guard and he has shown that he can make some incredible shots.  Competing with each other does not seem to make for the best result...playing to each of their strengths does.

 

Actually Patti I think the exact opposite has occurred. Boylan let Ellis run the show, Ellis did a hell of a job and Brandon felt he had to step up his game to compete.

 

I don't think Redick actually being on the court has made the difference, both Ellis and Jennings are and were capable of playing this way without Redick on the roster. Redick's addition represented a threat to BJEllis minutes and neither of them can afford to lose minutes in what will likely be a contract year for both.

 

The problem with Jennings and Ellis before wasn't that they were competing, it was that there was a lack of competition to push either of them to improve their efficiency and team-play. They settled in their me-first style of play that they were comfortable with and it wasn't working. Inter-team competition is almost always beneficial as long as the coach and players can keep the environment from becoming hostile. Pushing your teammates to improve is really what team sports are all about.

 

Maybe the Bucks can keep both Ellis and Jennings this offseason, but if that is going to happen these two will have to continue to play like they have lately or even better to be worth the combined 24+ million per season that it will cost to keep them. If you consider the fact that the Bucks might pursue Josh Smith then it seems even less likely that both will be around unless someone takes a pay-cut. Winning is worth a pay-cut.

[Kevin]

"Either way a battle for assists between Ellis and Jennings would be the greatest thing that could happen to the Bucks this season."

 

Or maybe that has been the problem with these two guys playing together all along.  Their roles not clearly defined.  Jennings passes the ball to Ellis and he takes over as point on any/every play.  Then Jennings gets the ball and feels he has to try and score.  Both players forcing shots and both players missing them at the same inefficient fg%.

 

What this team has needed is a scoring guard, which is why I was hopeful that bringing in Redick would clarify why our offense keeps breaking down even though we have this talent in the back-court.  

 

What I see the last two games is a better flow to the offense because they are playing their positions instead of fighting each other to take over the game.  Jennings isn't going to get bigger, so feed to Ellis strength at the rim.  Too often we saw Ellis jacking up a long jumper with 20 on the shot clock.  Let Jennings be the point guard and he has shown that he can play that position well.  He's better at the 3 pt and free throw.  Let Ellis be the scoring guard and he has shown that he can make some incredible shots.  Competing with each other does not seem to make for the best result...playing to each of their strengths does.

Both of them are still doing their fair share of the ball handling responsibilities. The main difference is that Jennings is starting to be more proactive in terms of setting up the offense as opposed to trying to score in isolation, or as you mentioned with Ellis and also applies to Jennings, trying to score with 20 seconds left on the shot clock because he feels like he's hot. 

 

Ellis is still taking a lot of mid-range jumpers, too. He just happens to be hitting a lot more of them right now.

 

The big thing we both seem to agree on is that Redick has been the big difference maker at this point. His ability to stretch the floor has allowed for others to have easier scoring opportunities, whether it be whoever else Jennings sets up, or Ellis getting more open looks when he takes control of the ball. 

 

In any case, this streak has looked promising in that we are performing much better offensively, but are also winning close games. Maybe a little too close for most people's taste, but it's also a good indication of how good this team can be in crunch time.